Gauges... what do i need?

So, starting to think of what gauges to run..

so far keeping budget in mind, the things i think i absolutely want are:

Tach,
Oil Pressure.
Water Temp.

that being said, this seems like a pretty good deal to me.
http://www.sunpro.com/product_detail.php?pid=16503

aside from autometer and sunpro, i dont really know any brands, and obviously it needs to be cheap.

you guys know of any other sources i should be looking at?

fuel level would be kinda nice, but im not sure how easy to get the readings for that would be.
I plan on running all mechanical gauges for simplicity, especially since I dont plan on running the "stock" gauge cluster harness at all.

ok, first a couple of questions:
1. pure track truck, or street driven?
2. NA or boost?
3. what dash are you going to run?
4. are you stuck on mechanical just because of the wiring?
5. what fuel tank?


answer these, and i can help you lay out a plan. i do this with customers all the time.

michael

I gotta agree with mike, electrical gauges can be easier than mechanical and lighter for a lot of applications, especially speedo, and less dangerous in the case of oil pressure. That line blows inside your dash and it will be a fire, plus the gauge reaction will be slower, because the 1/8" 4' long line will buffer the pressure.

yeah, I agree about the mechanical oil gauge.   

ok cool,
1. it will be a track truck which will get driven to the track.
no dailying at all.

2. NA for a couple years, I will always contemplate boosting, but I do not think it will happen anytime in the near future.

3. Sheetmetal dash, running silverado ECU, and not much else. not planning on hooking up BCM. no ac/hvac/ radio

4. yes, and cost. i just assumed sensors would double the cost?

5. stock 98 s10 tank. planning on running stock 4.3 fuel pump as I've read it should feed a stock 5.3 enough, but that might have to change, not sure yet.

how slow will the gauge reaction be? if its within half a second response time, i think that would be plenty good for me for now.
as for fire risk, why will it cause a fire? is that just based on ignition temps of some materials around the dash?

Also, do i need a speedo?

also, i have a spare laptop laying around.
anyway to easily have that display stuff?

Oil temps often reach 250 degrees during a beating, that makes the oil very thin, that line blows with 60psi on it and that thin oil gets sprayed on every connector inside the dash. I have seen two dash fires from oil lines blowing. Guage response with 1/8" line 4' long should be quick enough, but it's not the miliseconds of an electric guage. A speedo will definitely be helpful, if you run the same track often it is a lot easier to memorize corner entry and exit speeds, than it is entry and exit gear and rpm, and it'll help keep you from getting tickets on the way to and from the track.

There is no easy way of getting the info to display on a laptop, but it is easy to piggyback off the sensors that you're all ready going to have in order to do electronic guages. I still don't understand why GM runs the guages off the BCM instead of the ECM, the BCM has to request and read data off the ECM, the output to the guages, just over-complicated.

how often do GPS thingies update?
i know the cheapo looking gps we got with the rental vans in germany cam with some tomtom that had vehicle speed display on it.
butit only refreshed every 3 -5 seconds, so it would be pretty useful on a track, doable on the street.
how hard is it to wire up a speedo? i just assumed it would require some fabbing of a hall effect sensor on the rear end or something.

if i were to do an electric oil pressure gauge, where should i source the sensor for it?

found another cheaper source

http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/Tinted-334-tachometer-gauge.aspx
http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/Tinted-water-temperature-gauge.aspx
http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/Tinted-100psi-oil-pressure-gauge.aspx
http://www.glowshiftdirect.com/Tinted-transmission-temperature-gauge.aspx

$55, $33, $37, ($33) each with free shipping and they all include sensors.
with the multiple coil setup i'd need a 'tach adapter' for the tach to work,
anyone know what that is? im assuming its just a bunch of diodes to get a signal from each coil without interfering with the others right?

probably right, unless the ECM has a tach signal wire, I don't know enough about the LSx to help with that, sorry, I know the MSD LS coil controller has a tach signal, which is as far as I got on researching it.

sorry for the response time delay, ryo.

since it will be "somewhat" street driven, driving by tach is doable. especially since its not a daily.
speedos are very distracting on track. if youre drivng the vehicle under you, on the track under you, when its under you, the speedo makes no difference. in all my track yime, ive rarely ever looked at my speedo. only when i was distracted. and i shouldnt ave been distracted on track, trying to see how much speed i was carrying through the kink.

since yore going 5.3, EFI, 6 speed, track primary, stock tank, and sheetmetal dash, here would be my reccomendations.

1. tach, oil pressure, water temp, volts. all availible from summit as a 4 in one electric setup. fuel gauge of 0 ohms full and 90 empty should be right for your sender. standard GM stuff.
2. go electric. theyre really not all that much more than a mechanical, and in my opinion make service, install, and use much easier. reaction time and accuracy, assuming good install of both, is of negligible diference.
3. put the tach, oil pressure, water temp central. the volts and fuel gauge will rarely be looked at on track, mostly in pits and warm up/cool down laps. so put them out of direct line of sight.
4. use a big shift light on the a-pillar, where its easy to see.
5. clock all the gauges in the dash where the needles point straight up when things are good.
6. use a tomtom or other cheap GPS if you cant learn to drive by tach.

hope that helps.

Since you're goofing with a 5.3 as well, do you know if the ECM has a tach signal, or if he's going to have to diode isolate the grounds from all 8 coils, or for that matter if it's even necessary on a modern autometer or similar tach?

Thanks for the input,
come to think of it, every racecar i've built has never had a speedometer, and the tach consists of 7 LEDs.
when i drove it i never even looked at the tach, and our drivers never complained.
as for on the street, i can have a chart of rpms in each gear for the speedlimits till i memorize them, shouldnt be too bad, had a conversion chart back when i was low and had teeny wheels too.

I dunno, you'd think the little switch that lets you choose across 4-6-8 cylinders on the tachs would have a "1" on it for grounding to just one ground on some coil, but who knows. I'll look into it eventually, and same with the ecm tach signal out, dunno as of now.

On the fuel sender you will be looking for 240-33 ohms rather than the older 0-90 I believe.  GM switched over at some point in the 90's and I'm sure your truck is after the break.

with most modern tachs, you can use the tach signal from the ECM. i know my 3.4 swap has it coming from the coil pack, not the ECM. same difference, though.

autometer has tachs that work, and weve evn got a sunpro to do it. some tachs requre a DIS adapter, some dont.

and thanks for the sending unit breakdown. forgot about that last night.

michael

thanks harley, and so should i be looking for a specific note somewhere on the tach specs?
what is a DIS adapter? is that just a diode basket?

DIS adapter is for fords distributor-less ignition system, which has wasted spark, so it just essentially multiplies the number of signals coming in by half your engine size.

http://www.lt1swap.com/lsx_tach.htm